I’m starting to play with people and potentially gig, so I’ve been thinking about hardware. I could really use some purchasing input.
I’ve been playing guitar for a long time, and I’m about a year into home recording in Ableton. I run Neural DSP plugins exclusively using Rabea, Asato, Wong, Soldano, Gojira. I make shoegaze-adjacent, darkwave instrumental music. What I love about the Neural is that each plugin drops me into the right ballpark immediately. I get to enjoy surfing for a vibe. I am not someone who enjoys tweaking tones or trying to replicate specific amps - the whole chain being great, focused, and curated is such a huge pro for me with Neural DSP plug-ins.
The QC feels like the obvious choice but the price is beyond my means right now. I tried a Pod Go and a Helix recently (both sounded good) but I kept getting pulled into tweaking instead of just playing. I read this thread and found it really validating: How does this realistically compare to the Helix? ( “less tweaking, more playing”)
So… are there budget alternatives to the QC? I’m looking at the Kemper Player Profiler and HeadRush (intrigued by their synth stuff but haven’t tried it). Is the QC really the only/best option for me? If so, I will just save and budget. Or have people had success replicating their neural presets on other hardware with minimal effort?
Used Helix LT + Floor. Nano Cortex maybe…. depending on how many effects you need. I wouldn’t really recommend anything else for 600, especially if the Line 6 stuff wasn’t amazing to you. That’s sort of the best of what exists at that price tbh.
I tried Headrush and it’s terrible. I wouldn’t even suggest that stuff to anyone. Kemper player is annoying to set up and you might as well get a Nano Cortex at that point. The Kemper Player has a weird paywall for certain features.
Maybe get a Nano Cortex and capture your plugin sounds? Or try captures that other people have for it.
Thank you. Dumb question: but the capture only gets the IR/amp, right? It’s not going to copy/capture the effects chain, right? That would require manually rebuilding…?
That’s the kind of input what I was looking for re. headrush and Kemper. Thanks @SelfTitledLP
Who knows what you are looking for but you? With such a question you’ll have to be extremely precise and specifying, meanwhile you’re not looking for any such specific amp or artists sounds so…? You can sit here forever replying: “Nope, that’s not what I’m looking for either”.
It depends on the sound you’re looking (listening) for? You don’t like to tweak much it’s a matter of sheer blind luck finding anything that suits you, unless your margins are very wide. Especially at this level of quality.
Suppose “free” NAM models are out of the question too then? (“Nope, that’s not what I’m looking for either”.)?
A capture (same for Kemper) will only do effects that aren’t pitch, modulation, or time based (delay, reverb). So drive pedals, amp, cabinet, power amp, etc.
I guess you could look into a NAM player. There are some Hotone, etc brands that have multi effects units with that. I haven’t ever used them so I can’t say how they are. They would work in a similar way though, and regardless you have to build your sound with blocks that they have.
@jpc Sincere apologies for (possibly) coming across too coarse. Think you placed your needs unreasonably asking between a lot of stools and it send my mind in several conflicting short circuit directions. That’s of cause my bad.
It’s like going into a shoe store asking ”just” for a pair of any colour shoes that’s somewhere in the style of moon boots, 17th century german clogs and barefoot sneakers or from the sofa asking mom what’s in the fridge when she’s just finished preparing dinner.
You write you’ve played a lot, tried a few modelers, but your general question seems both informed and in another way happy go lucky beginner, no insult intended. Aren’t we all happy beginners at something?
Fx Darkwave and shoegaze are expanding as ”genres” over multiple generations/decades.
Your plugins range from Wong over Asato to Gojira. Very wide span, not to say extreme. Right? Kudos for that musically, but you know, it’s kinda something of a stretch too.
You want world class sounds for cheep, without tweaking too much instead of playing − which leads to that you do definitely NOT wanna plunge into the deep dive pitfall/rabbit hole of NAM.
And please don’t take my cheesy intro joke seriously, just couldn’t help it, that ”WC” too send my imagination off the charts.
Please specify further for this here ignorant fool
@kNow2 thanks. All good. I always struggle with how much detail to put in forum posts so that it’s not too long, but also provides enough specifics to get useful feedback.
I play across a lot of genres for fun. I have a friend with a Rage cover band I’m going to sit in with, another who’s into synthpop, and my own stuff tends to be heavily treated Asato tones (clean and broken up), Rabea’s synth stuff, and some good crunch here and there (Often SLO). Wong is my least used, but I seriously love the reverb and The 80s pedal in there
The consensus seems to be that there isn’t a more affordable option that would be worth adjusting my workflow for, and that the QC is probably just the right move and I need to save up for it.
I did get some cool suggestions on something like the Valeton GP-5 for the time being since it’s so cheap, and then I at least have a non-laptop hardware solution for now.
People seem to like HeadRush once they get the right presets, and it seems like a lot of Neural DSP users have uploaded patches. But it also seems like a lot of Neural DSP users eventually get rid of their HeadRush and go with the Cortex.
Seems like the only legit contender I came across was the Fractal AM4, but it has no synth block, and once you step up to their models that do, the price gets close enough to the QC that it stops making sense.
I should mention I’m pretty new to the hardware DSP space, and it’s cool that this whole space seems to be exploding right now…but there’s a lot of noise on the internet with people calling each other’s gear trash. It’s genuinely hard to find the signal through the noise when you’re looking for people who have actually used multiple products and have similar taste. I’ve gotten a lot of “you’re a victim of Neural’s marketing” noise from people outside this community , but I genuinely love the Neural ecosystem and I’m happy to pay for it. Just wanted some validation from people who actually understand the platform before committing to a big purchase.
Anyhow, it’s all good and I appreciate you taking the time.
Thank you so much likewise taking your time to answer.
Feels like you’ve already researched well and found what you wanted here. Neural marketing or not, the sound you hear is the most important.
Had the exact same curve of decision making when I was looking around for a top tier upgrade. Saved up too and purchased a second hand QC as soon as i could afford it.
Then I would save up and buy the QC long term. If you’re comparing everything to Neural, get Neural. Otherwise there are lots of options, just check out a site like guitarist or other major guitar gear publishers, they have “best all in 1 modeller” articles. Imo bringing the QC is not any less effort than a laptop, but you know what you want.
@jpc BTW we may not have the same taste in all music but definitely a similar wide range in what we enjoy playing. Lol: Actually had you mentioned the Abasi plugin I would have computed much better
@kNow2 Thanks. What finally tipped the scales for the QC?
@h2loh Thanks. Yeah I’ve read just about everything at this point. Sweetwater has a useful post about the top options. Their whole list seems great…but, again, not sure how well it would fit my workflow, and then I’m wondering if I should just revamp my workflow because I’m new to this. I did a bunch of research last year about which plugin/dsp to go with. Demo’d the NDSP stuff and loved it. I knew the Tonex stuff had mixed reviews, and I tried a Pod Go and didn’t love it. Hence the Neural investment. So, I’m comparing everything against that, but part of why I’m posting here is to ensure I’m not missing something due to lack of experience.
The sound, more specifically the clean sound. A/B’ed to a Fractal in a YT comparison (yes the sound there doesn’t represent reality, but since it was the clean). Sounded cleaner/clearer to me. Not that the Fractal was bad at all, just what sounded best in my ears. The basis for me have always been the cleans, then one can always build from there.
Back when playing in my latest band − Thrash/Crossover with some Punk and Meshuggah’ish odd meters (we actually opened once for them when they were rising up) − ”my sound” was build around a Hartke alu cone cap/amp which have bright cleans punching through the mix (not a term back then). Helped me being more precise too, besides our drummer who drilled us hard through the paces.
It was before the Darkglass dual channel sound that keeps the bass low depth through a distortion. Maybe a few used the Amped amp with a Tubescreamer as a clean boost, but I didn’t know that trick ‘till much later.
Take a good long look at Hotone Ampero II, either the Stomp ($500) or Stage ($700). I bought an Ampero Mini a while back as a little travel MFX that would be great for a weekend trip or short vacation. I am amazed at the versatility of that tiny little box. 9 slot signal chain, 50-60 amp/cab models, 200+ effects, IR loader, touchscreen (really good), looper, drum machine, audio interface, headphone jack, aux in, desktop control software (think Cortex Control). All for around $200. I grant you it’s not the QC in terms of quality & power but the Ampero II gear has new modeling software that to me sounds at least on a level with Line 6 stuff. With your budget, @jpc , I’d take a look.
IK Multimedia that makes Tonex just presented their platform with “preset sharing” yesterday April 2. Prior to this date, may I add, it wasn’t within the asked easy access perimeter, so… ?
Similar look to virtual amp/effects plugins. Even with preview (prelisten that is). Immense upgrade. Sounds cool.
All physical Tonex devises are seemingly compatible, new as old.
Disclaimer: it might just take a while before one’s specific preferences appear as presets.
t in nature”. A very good book for hikers.
, but I genuinely love the Neural ecosystem and I’m happy to pay for it. Just wanted some validation from people who actually understand the platform before committing to a big purchase.
). Helped me being more precise too, besides our drummer who drilled us hard through the paces.