I’m new to the QC world. Haven’t bought it yet. I’m trying to solve queries first before make my decision. I need guidance please.
I search around the QC user manual and connectivity with Analog Amplifiers and I can’t see any suggested configuration where I can simply feed the signal from the Outputs 3/4 of the QC to the RETURN of a real amp. The most common thing in the world after all.
Why is that? Search pages 62-66 of the user manual. Nothing relevant there.
The purpose of that is obviously to bypass completely the preamp / eq section and everything else of the real amp and use only its power amp and nothing else, just to monitor my self on stage with a WET signal directly from the QC.
I would like to have the ability one part of the signal to be sent to the stage amp via the RETURN of the amp (as described above) and another part of the signal to be sent to FOH via the XLR Outputs.
I don’t want to mess with the 4-cable method. Too much cables and mess, while I don’t want to use the preamp stage of the real amps on stage.
I am pretty sure people do this quite often. I think the only thing to consider is how the models and captures will be influenced by the power section of whatever tube amp you are plugging into. But thats why some guys choose to do the whole power amp flat frequency cab or get a powered FRFR cab. But as long as you dont mind the coloration you may get in the sound of the power section of your amp choice there is certainly no harm that is going to come from doing so.
I think this is more amp dependent than quad dependent. You have control in the swipe down menu for the I/O interface where you can make outputs stereo, mono and a lot of options. As long as your amps return can act as a passthrough allowing the signal of the quad to go through to the speaker cab then yeah. Send the XLR’s to FOH and send a guitar cable from the quad to the return and if Im remembering correctly its good to mute any output you are not using.
I think there is a DB difference in the two different outputs. One being 6db louder I think? so I think thats the only other thing that may need to be compensated for. I dont really see this as being any different than the guys that run to front of house and run outputs to a powered wedge or FRFR on stage. Besides. Take 10 different FRFR setups and they all color the sound to some degree.
The QC manual depicts the 4-Cable Method (4CM) on page 64. Look at that setup closer.
I‘m using the QC with an Amp with 4CM. Works well.
With 4CM you can use the Amp power stage only (just don’t use the FX-Loop block in your QC signal chain).
Simply said:
Guitar to QC Input 1/2 , Out 3/4 to Amp Return, QC Out 1/2 to FOH. In your QC signal chain you can pick the signal wherefrom you like and route it to the dedicated outputs.
Be aware that amps and amp effects loops do vary. Some will bypass the loop if there is nothing plugged in to the Send, such that the Return will not operate.
You may also find that the amp Volume or Master Volume will have no effect, meaning that the power section and the input from the QC will be at full power with no control on the amp. You would only be able to control volume using the output volume of the QC.
Another issue is the level expected by the amp’s Return. This will often be matched to the amp’s Send level, and these are notoriously variable. You would expect something in the ballpark of Instrument or Line level, but some amps have a very high Send level and need a similar high level into the Return. Modellers may struggle to output enough signal, and you may find volume out of the amp to speakers surprisingly low.
I have also found that Send/Return loops in many amps are very susceptible to RF interference, causing lots of noise. I always use the effects loops in amps, and I have had to return amps that I have bought because the noise level is too high. They work fine with a cable into the front, but RF noise using the effects loop makes them unusable. This is obviously subject to local conditions, and some venues may be a nightmare.
You will only find out if a particular amp will work with a modeller in this way by trying it. This is not peculiar to the QC, and other modellers will suffer the same problems with amps that are not compatible to be used in this way. Make sure that your amp will work with a modeller as you intend to use it before you commit.
I play various gigs in various places-different cities, always with different equipment (bass amps and bass cabinets) provided by the place. I have no control to what amp will occasionally be present.
The stage amp is just to monitor myself with something convincing. It’s not the same to monitor your bass by the stage monitors.
The purpose of buying the QC (If I buy it) is the portability. One unit in your bag and there you go. But if I have to carry and my amp or my personal powered speaker or FRFR in which I may have the control of it…. Then I can’t see any portability and ease on that.
As you say and as I understand it…. The QC (and/or other modelers) is meant for FOH and not for stage amps? The issues that you mention are serious problems and I can’t see any particular reason to spend 1.600€ if I have to face issues like those that you mention.
All of these issues can happen with any modeller used in the way you were proposing. If you were using the same amp every time, you could test everything out. If it is pot luck at every venue, it is likely to be a very risky strategy.
But on the other hand it is obvious that the use of amp modelers should be something that you don’t have to bring and your amp together.
Don’t you feel the same?
Cause (beside the effects) if you have to carry and your amp together just to be safe, why to spend so much money for an amp modeler? You could just bring your amp.
I use the QC mostly for guitar, occasionally for bass.
I never bring an amp, I always use the monitor speakers on stage.
Yes, you could also use a guitar / bass amps return channel, but as @NigelGBR mentioned, it may give a problem with some amps. In these cases, you could still use the amps normal input, even if it will color the sound even more.
I think you will have to decide if you bring a small amp or FRFR speaker with you to be safe, or rely on the monitor speakers. Relying on amps that you do not know also seems a bit risky to me. But ok, you could still use the monitor speakers if you face problems with the on-stage amp.
The benefit of most modern bass amps is that the power stage is fairly clean, unlike the tonal aspects you see with guitar.
I use the QC for bass only and I’d keep a split setup: one output with cab IR/model, if you want, as a DI for FOH. And then one output going to the amp return, probably bypassing the cab modeling, as you’ll hear yourself through the connected cab. Add an eq on that chain to be able to adjust the stage sound a little, while not affecting what goes out to FOH.
