Would be nice to have a tool to do time & phase alignment in the “Mixer” menu.
A way to align phases just not 180 but in a variable manner it’s key to running 2 captures together.
This is an important request.
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Hate to bring back a year old thread, but… not sorry. Lol.
I agree with this. There needs to be a variable delay feature, not just 180 flip. Even with the reversed polarity, there seems to still be phase issues when running 2 amps (more or less noticeable depending on the combination).
Problem is, I’ve noticed this just by simply adding a parallel path. I will need to check it again later today, but I think I’m right.
It might not be a phase issue with amp captures, it may be the parallel path itself.
I’m other words, try to setup a reverb in parallel and turn the mix to 100% dry. You will notice phase issues when block is engaged vs when it’s off.
So, it might be that the amp capture is fine, but parallel path is delayed a few milliseconds.
That means no amount of variable adjustment would benefit on the 2nd path. You would need to delay the first path to match the 2nd. But then that just introduces latency to what you’re playing. I don’t want that either.
Basically, I’ve just had to drop complex routing setups. Unfortunate really.
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I’ve always wondered how much latency is introduced when adding blocks. I have a bass patch setup with one row acting as the “amped” signal and another row as straight DI with no effects. The amped signal has a comp before the amp and a bit of room verb at the end. Are these two signals coming in fairly aligned or does this add enough latency for it to make a noticable difference?
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I have not tested, so no real basis for this belief.
But I think the minute you add the comp on the dry signal line, it should match the amped line. Not sure though.
IMO
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micro phase alignment * IS * needed. Fractal does not offer this either and I have just as much of an issue using parallel flow for bass tones there as I do on the QC. Often 0/180 is good enough, but sometimes neither is correct. You can cheat with a delay or carefully constructed IR, but neither are a good solution
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Cross-posting my notes from Add fully adjustable 360 degree phase control in splitter here:
A workaround I’ve found is to add disabled blocks to either signal chain, which will add just enough delay to nudge the phase relationship.
I discovered this hack when I noticed that my sound got out of phase when I removed blocks. For this reason I currently have two disabled cab blocks in my 2nd signal chain.
This of course heavily limits my ability to use the device, as I can’t just add or remove blocks, without risking destroying the phase relationship.
I’ve tried gaining more control over the phase issue by using the “simple delay” block, however 7ms (+ probably the delay added by the block itself) are way too much
If better phase adjustment is added to the gain block, that would be cool.
However, this still doesn’t fix the problem of needing to adjust the phase relationship whenever you add or remove blocks.
It would therefore be great to add an in-phase mode, where the device ensures all signal paths are subject to the same amount of block-induced delay.
For now I’ve come to the conclusion that as a live unit I can only use one signal path, and will reserve the ability to use multiple amps for recordings, where the engineer can adjust the phase relationship precisely.
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Great response and ideas. I will check out some of your suggestions.
Yes! Very important! Was thinking about making a thread about this the other day…
I also have phase-issues just from parallel paths sometimes. Really annoying to not be able to fix it properly. With parallell paths they should be able to have an algorithm to fix it automaticly like DAW’s do with plugins etc. I guess other modelers do it too since I’ve never experienced this issue with Axe FX or Helix.
A workaround that works sometimes is to put a clean delay on both paths and adjust the ms, but since it’s only possible to change in 1ms steps it doesn’t allways work…
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Yeah, this is just one of those issues I’m surprised wasn’t considered in the initial release of the unit. It seems like an obvious thing.
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If anyone wants to try it, just add a parallel path and add a reverb. Then, dial it to 100% dry.
First, you’ll notice that you need to tweak the output level on the mixer return, switching back and forth between block “on” and “off” state. It’s way hotter than path 1 only.
Then, engage and disengage reverb block. You’ll notice that it’s out of phase. And switching the polarity doesn’t help.
This is what happens when you add a parallel path to run 2 amps. It’s out of phase. Depending on the amp, some are worse than others. And the only way I see to fix it is to add a delay block to path 1 before the amp to have it get closer.
I agree that whole millisecond increments may be in between where it needs to be. Should be continually variable.
Also, it’s a bandaid because delaying line 1 is going to mess with the “feel” and how the amp reacts to your playing.
I’m not bashing the QC. I love it. Do I wish I could layer amps? Yes. Can I do 100% wet on a parallel path and not have to worry about phase? Yes. But, would be nice to be able to add say a delay on path 1 and a different delay in parallel on path 2 before the verb. Can’t do that unless 2nd delay is 100% wet and that would just delay the start of the verb.
I’m just saying that I’ve owned an HX STOMP an FM3 and FM9 and have never had this problem.
So, for now, it’s one amp, one delay and a reverb in parallel 100% wet.
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I’m really hoping for micro-phase adjustment. It would be a big win, especially since there aren’t other units that do anything like this.
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Even with 3.0 they have no phase alignment but it does seem like there is some wonky phase tweaking on the backend. I have been using the IR loader-lite block to correct phase because it has .01ms latency adjustment but the 3.0 update caused the timings to be off.
Added in 3.0:
Dynamic Latency Compensation
A Dynamic Latency Compensation option is available via Settings > Device Options. Disabling this may help if phasing occurs when bypassing a device on the Grid.
Would be cool to know what EXACTLY the dynamic latency compensation does (or does not when turned off)
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Was literally thinking this just now
It’s so weird. Here we have this feature request that NDSP actually added but without telling anyone. And the feature request remains. And even better, it doesn’t work. I tried on multiple presets where I had phase issues. I can get rid of them by flipping the phase on a block, but turning on and off the Dynamic Latency Compensation doesn’t do anything.